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FAQ: Oil Pan Replacement?

 

How I Changed my OIL PAN!

Original Message:
Subj: Re: [C34] The Oil Pan
Well, here's the first of perhaps a few updates as to the Oil Pan Dilemma. As usual, thanks to Ron H & Stu J. for their advice & support.
Further inspection reveals: The damage (corrosion) was done quite awhile ago. When I rebuilt the Sherwood last year, I solved the leak problem, but I should have also resolved all the corrosion damage that was so evident elsewhere. Hindsight...And word to the wise is sufficient here: Look diligently for any sign of corrosion. Fix immediately. No, sooner than immediate. Fix definitively. In my humble, inexperienced opinion, corrosion is the equivalent of engine cancer. So get it all or it just starts spreading again.
Universal Parts:  Southern California offers a Universal "Master Distributor"; which means getting the parts wasn't as hard as I thought it would be. Prices were within reason until we got to the oil pan itself: $225.00. As you know, or FYI: the Westerbeke/Universal website has a dealer locator - good starting point/resource: www.westerbeke.com
FYI - Rebuilt Universal M25-XP(A) Engines: This particular Universal dealer offered them at $5,600.
BTW, Ron's advice on oil pan removal is, as usual, excellent and in this case confirmed by local diesel engine mechanics. I will, however, remain undaunted, and plan to re-torque those pan bolts the hard way.
LeMasters, BLUE MOON, #753, JAL@flashcom.net
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Subj: Re: [C34] The Oil Pan
LeMasters : A few ideas. Take your oil pan to a Kubota dealer and match it up with their C1100 engine. I think you'll see a BIG price break. If you are bound and determined to go with a "Universal" pan and are a Boat US member you can also get a small (10-15%) cut by ordering it thru them.
If you were thinking about a rebuilt M25XPA - I'd recommend paying another $1K and get a New M25XPB which is the same block/dimensions, but has 3 more hp!!!
You can lift the engine up 2-4" with only disconnecting the exhaust from muffler intake. All other wires and hoses can remain connected. I'm not to sure if this is sufficient height to get a torque wrench under, but it's better than nothing.
By the way while you've got the engine up - change the engine mounts! I can't believe the difference the Vetus K50 mounts made on smoothing out my 25XP. After idle there's NO rpm that's smoother than another!!!! From 1200 to 3200 the only change is that the engine is louder. The K50 mounts are similar the new style Universal mounts.
I don't have my engine manuals hardy, but I'll guess at about 25-30 foot pounds of torque. I'm not to sure what to advise, but if you only lift the engine you'll have to brace it, keeping it from turning while torquing. Lifting the engine is easy as it only weighs 309lbs. with transmission. The engine has 2 lifting eyes on it although I didn't use them. If you want to use a 4:1 block and tackle on to the boom let me know and I'll give you a few tips.
When you get your task completed (don't forget to take some pictures) write an article for the Mainsheet and send it to Bill Nuttall. I'm sure Al will want the same for the C34 Net. Keep me posted. Best of luck.
Ron, APACHE, #788, ronphylhill@erols.com

Subj: [C34] Oil Pan
Ron, in your previous emails, you mentioned the difficulty in torqueing the Oil Pan bolts down while the engine is still in place. I can't find anywhere in the Universal service manual, or in either of my generic diesel engine manuals where torqueing is required and/or suggested. i.e., I can't find the torque specifications.
However, I am now planning on torqueing them anyway, based on your info. Can you confirm this for me?
Also, can you verify the number mentioned in your most recent email of 25-30 foot/pounds?
BTW, I found a torque wrench that'll fit under the attached oil pan, & using a mirror, I'll be able to retorque without having to lift the engine. (I am, however, STRONGLY considering acting upon your advice & replacing the engine mounts. (No, I won't try to do THAT without lifting the engine!!)
Now here's the update:
Despite being told by local diesel mechanics that since the pan had been ON the engine for 12 years that it would take another 12 years to get it OFF, I found that it was more like 12 minutes. (Excluding the time it took to pull those 18 pan bolts). Hammer & non-metallic wedge/chisel device aimed at the grove in the pan (this per the Universal Service manual instruction). Worked like a charm.
Was also greatly relieved to NOT find tiny metallic parts at the bottom of the oil pan.
MANY THANKS to whomever suggested those oil absorbent pads. (Unrelated email few months ago). Owe you a drink.
In case anyone's still reading this far down, I will again harp on the dangers of not controlling corrosion. The bolts holding the dip stick tube onto the oil pan were so corroded, I could not separate the tube from the pan. The pan is probably worth salvaging, but because I haven't yet found a way to remove the tube without damaging (or at least potentially compromising the integrity of) the pan, I've bought a new one. ($225) The lesson: Had I been good about checking for engine corrosion, I wouldn't have ANY problem. Had I been even sloppy about checking, the total repair cost probably would have stayed under $100, including a new gasket for the pan, new oil filter, fresh oil, new dip stick tube & maybe even 5 or 6 new really cool tools. But my laziness/negligence has ended up costing a good $300+. Not counting the messy cleanup time & missed sailing time.
word to the wise...John LeMasters, BLUE MOON #753, JAL@flashcom.net
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Subj: [C34] Oil Pan
John : All my manuals are on the boat so I went to my Ford Taurus shop manuals. On an oil pan reinstallation Ford recommends 8-10 ft.lbs. Now that I think about it again 25 is too much. All you are trying to do is get all the bolts EVENLY snugged down. The gasket will compress(crush) a little.
On the nondrying sealant I'd recommend #2 Non Hardening Permatex - I've always had good luck with it. Make sure that you use it on BOTH sides of the gasket and alittle goes a long way. The pan and engine surfaces must be absolutely clean of old gasket and oil.
Before you dumped the old oil you should have run a magnet thru it - that's the way to find minuet "chips".
Ron, APACHE #788, ronphylhill@erols.com

Subj: [C34] Oil Pan
Okay, so torque oil pan bolts somewhere between 10 - 20 ft.lbs.- EVENLY being the operative word. Apparently torque wrenches are a must have tool for engine work. In fact, I found a marine diesel book that identifies them as "essential" for the cruiser's toolbox.
I've begun a video of this entire oil pan replacement process, including the gut-wrenching "before" shot. Am looking for a way to offer this to the C34 site in a format that won't take too long to download; suggestions are welcomed.
Bon Voyage, Ron, & thanks to you & the list for all the help
John LeMasters, BLUE MOON, #753, JAL@flashcom.net
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Subj: Re: [C34] Oil Pan Bolt Torque
The engine manual does not specifically refer to any torque values for the oil pan bolts. The only reference is on page 120 under notes for reassembly where it says to apply a nondrying adhesive and install the oil pan. It notes that the bolts should be tightened in diagonal order from the center. That's it!
There are however some generic torques for metric bolts depending on their diameter and material grade that may be of help.

Dia in mm Torque in ft/lbs (for standard grade bolts, type SS41, S20C)
6mm   5.8-6.9
8mm   13.0-15.2
10mm 28.9-33.3
12mm 46.3-53.5

I would be cautious and err on the side of too little rather than too much to avoid distortion of the sheet metal pan. It's a lot easier to have to retighten a bolt or 2 later than to have to drop the pan and try to true up the sealing surface.
Bob L., "Sjora", SvSjora@aol.com

Important: The opinions expressed here are those of the individual contributors to this page, and not those of the Catalina 34 National Association or Catalina Yachts, Inc. Additionally, this material has not been reviewed by Catalina Yachts, Inc. for technical accuracy. This page's maintainer cannot guarantee the accuracy of this information or the desirability of suggested modifications or upgrades. Please obtain assistance from a competent marine mechanic or boatyard prior to making any significant modifications to your vessel.   

Last modified by Phil Imhof, Wednesday, August 11, 2004 . Copyright 2001 by Catalina 34 International Association.  All rights reserved.